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Sometimes I want to holler, sometimes I want to shout. Sometimes I want to cry, and wonder what about. I think I got the blues - Sonny Terry, I Think I Got The Blues

Author Topic: Third Man Records & Document teaming up  (Read 4923 times)

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Offline misterjones

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #60 on: February 01, 2013, 01:59:12 PM »
I remain skeptical that the new "Yazoo" LPs are officially authorized by any of the old Yazoo people.

But I wouldn't mind listening to that Cliff Edwards collection.

« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 02:02:47 PM by misterjones »

Offline Bunker Hill

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #61 on: February 01, 2013, 11:29:36 PM »
Someone at Fantasy Records (Orin Keepnews or his brother Peter?) acquired the original 78 stampers somehow, I've been told.
My "mind's eye" can visualise a report of this as a Blues Unlimited, Blues World or Living Blues news item.

Offline frankie

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #62 on: February 02, 2013, 04:01:42 AM »
I remain skeptical that the new "Yazoo" LPs are officially authorized by any of the old Yazoo people.

I don't think Yazoo "authorized" them, but they certainly are aware of them. In contrast, the Secret Museum "Yazoo" LPs were done with some cooperation from Yazoo.

But I wouldn't mind listening to that Cliff Edwards collection.



I have that rekkid! the real one! :)

Re: sound quality between LP and CD - i'm not enough of an audio nerd to care too much about the difference, but MAN, would I rather HOLD and LOOK AT an LP...  for sure! Not to mention that it's pleasing in a way just to have the natural "intermission" of the two (or more) sides.

Offline frankie

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #63 on: February 02, 2013, 12:05:07 PM »
not to mention....  an LP that's slightly warped, has a scratch or some surface wear is usually playable and has most, if not all, the information on it intact...  a CD in the same condition? It can be a real crap shoot.

LPs are a much more interesting document, overall.

Offline Lastfirstface

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #64 on: February 04, 2013, 01:00:10 PM »
not to mention....  an LP that's slightly warped, has a scratch or some surface wear is usually playable and has most, if not all, the information on it intact...  a CD in the same condition? It can be a real crap shoot.
That's something I like a lot about vinyl. Analog media always seem more likely to degrade while digital has a tendency to fail catastrophically!

Offline oddenda

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #65 on: February 08, 2013, 07:02:10 AM »
That's a cute thing that Jack White is doing regarding the Document albums, retro'ing them back into LPs. Would that he or someone like that would give me a leg up with the 80+ albums embedded in my unreleased field recordings from the 70s, mainly from the SE and all excellent, worthy stuff. But the issued material didn't sell all that well back in the day and I don't believe in miracles. Life is unfair.

Peter B.

Offline unezrider

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #66 on: February 08, 2013, 12:53:12 PM »
hello friend,
this little tid-bit was in todays document records email

Each recording, taken from the Document vaults, has been revisited and painstakingly sound restored whilst taking great care to preserve the integrity of original the recordings found on these incredibly rare and historic items. Many being only one known copy to have survived.

kinda answers the "source" question.
"Be good, & you will be lonesome." -Mark Twain

Offline misterjones

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #67 on: February 08, 2013, 01:09:39 PM »
Each recording, taken from the Document vaults, has been revisited and painstakingly sound restored whilst taking great care to preserve the integrity of original the recordings found on these incredibly rare and historic items.

I'm not sure this answers the source question.  Whereas "taken from the Document vaults" suggests that original non-digital sources were used, the subsequent sound restoration might just have been the creation of new digital versions.

But if one must digitize the recordings to maximize sound restoration and if, once restored, a vinyl playback creates a better sound than a digital playback, then Document Records might be appropriately ultizing the best of both worlds.

Of course, there's the separate issue of what's in Document's vaults to begin with.  My experience has been that the quality of these recordings to a certain extent has been superseded by other labels (notably Yazoo). 

This further raises the question whether the best LPs would be straight vinyl copies of Yazoo's more recent CDs.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2013, 01:13:57 PM by misterjones »

Offline dj

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #68 on: February 08, 2013, 02:52:00 PM »
It occurs to me that there really is never going to be a "best" version of any of this stuff.  Take songs like Pony Blues or Down The Dirt Road by Charley Patton.  I have those songs from three sources, all fairly well remastered: The Yazoo King Of The Delta Blues CD, the Revenant box, and the Blues Images CDs.  But If I'm really listening carefully to figure out a word or a note, I find that some parts of a given song are clearer on one CD, some on another.

So I guess the only thing to do is to keep getting Patton/McTell/Sheiks issue as it comes out.  Eventually one would have dozens of versions of each song and all would become clear.    :P

Offline misterjones

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #69 on: February 09, 2013, 09:34:36 AM »
But wouldn't it make sense that the best-sounding (say) Patton recording be an LP version of the two recent Patton CDs?  Or would I not be able to sense a difference between that LP and the CD?  If the manner of playback (as opposed to creation) does not matter, then I suppose I should stick with my CDs.

Offline uncle bud

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #70 on: February 09, 2013, 10:56:58 AM »
As has been pointed out before, what's in the "Document vaults" ranges from good to really shitty, and sound quality was not at all what was driving the original project, it was assembling the most complete catalogue of recordings possible. That's why I buy them, to have access to complete recordings, rather than some carefully selected, mastered and annotated anthology. The sound and mastering quality on almost all Document releases is highly variable, to put it politely. So taking Document as a starting point for a project like this will not result in any kind of best sounding release, no matter how much it's tinkered with nor how warm vinyl sounds.

There are lots of reasons to complain about Document releases and people do. But until some miracle worker with unlimited cash reserves convinces all the mildly to seriously deranged owners of prewar blues 78s to hand over everyone one of their babies for the proper treatment, Document's what we got and I'm happy we've got it.

As for Third Man, comparing the Sheiks' sample on Soundcloud with the Document tells me at least some fiddling with EQ was done. Much brighter version of Jake Leg.

Offline Adam Franklin

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #71 on: February 09, 2013, 11:10:21 AM »
I remain skeptical that the new "Yazoo" LPs are officially authorized by any of the old Yazoo people.

I don't think Yazoo "authorized" them, but they certainly are aware of them. In contrast, the Secret Museum "Yazoo" LPs were done with some cooperation from Yazoo.

But I wouldn't mind listening to that Cliff Edwards collection.



I have that rekkid! the real one! :)

Re: sound quality between LP and CD - i'm not enough of an audio nerd to care too much about the difference, but MAN, would I rather HOLD and LOOK AT an LP...  for sure! Not to mention that it's pleasing in a way just to have the natural "intermission" of the two (or more) sides.

You said it Frankie. I found an lp by Man years back, it opens up with a huge self folding map of Wales. Try putting that in a jewel case. Cds don't smell either.

Adam.

Offline Parlor Picker

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #72 on: February 10, 2013, 02:31:41 AM »
I dug that LP out and played it yesterday. I inherited it from my late father-in-law who was a great crooner and played ukulele.
"I ain't good looking, teeth don't shine like pearls,
So glad good looks don't take you through this world."
Barbecue Bob

Offline CF

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Re: Third Man Records & Document teaming up
« Reply #73 on: February 13, 2013, 09:41:34 AM »
The Patton release has an alt take of 'Lord, I'm Discouraged' listed. There are apparently typos galore on these but I'm wondering if this is the real thing, I seem to be only able to see one take of that song on all my discs.
Stand By If You Wanna Hear It Again . . .

Offline jostber

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