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Author Topic: Miller's Breakdown  (Read 93392 times)

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Offline Prof Scratchy

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2025 on: February 22, 2019, 07:17:09 AM »
For the IV chord x04535?


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Offline Norfolk Slim

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2026 on: February 22, 2019, 01:39:24 PM »
554535?

Offline David Kaatz

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2027 on: February 22, 2019, 03:11:42 PM »
Wow, hard to hear the IV chord with the bass playing in there too. I think maybe:
x
3
5
4
x
x

Offline Old Man Ned

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2028 on: February 23, 2019, 11:36:11 AM »
On more listening, is he fingering it around
0
3
5
4
X
5

Not always using the open E, but it's there if he feels like it?

Offline Pan

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2029 on: February 23, 2019, 03:22:05 PM »
How about an  X-0-4-5-5-5?

Great tune from Lightnin'!

Cheers

Pan

Offline waxwing

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2030 on: February 23, 2019, 03:57:45 PM »
I think most of the regulars have responded so I don't think this is a spoiler, and I may not be around during the week when you provide your transcription Johnm.

Lightnin' played Shinin' Moon on a TV show around 1970, a video of which is included and taught by Ernie Hawkins in his Guitar Workshop lesson on Lightnin'. He definitely developed the arrangement somewhat in the almost 20 years between these two, so not what he does here exactly. Per Ernie, and readily visible, he fingers xx45x5, strumming on the down beat (damping the 2nd string), and then on the 3rd beat slides his thumb up from the 3rd to 5th frets on the 5th and 6th strings to complete the chord as 5545x5. He clearly had not added the slide up in the bass at the time of this earlier recording, but anyone who plays the song will want to see the video for some more ideas. He adds a quick IV in the second measure, with the same bass slide, and utilizes the repeating hammer-on from the open G to the A extensively at the intro and elsewhere.

I never really worked this one up, so thanks for bringing my attention to it again Johnm. I've been playing out more and this would be a fun one to play. And it's a good example of how a player develops a performance over time, which is something you have posted about in the past Johnm. I particularly think the addition of the quick IV is interesting, and wonder if Lightnin' used it in earlier recordings or if it is something he picked up in the 50s-60s?

Lighnin's clip is at the beginning of the video.



Wax
« Last Edit: February 23, 2019, 04:05:32 PM by waxwing »
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Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2031 on: March 01, 2019, 09:47:25 AM »
Hi all,
There haven't been any recent responses to the Lightnin' Hopkins puzzler on "Shining Moon", so I'll post the answers.

For Lightnin' Hopkins' "Shining Moon":
   * His playing position was A in standard tuning, as everyone who responded had it--well done!
   * Lightnin' fretted the run he played in his solo from 1:09--1:12 as follows:  He began the run on beat two of the measure playing a triplet that begins with a slide to the fifth fret of the second string, going from there to the third and then the fourth fret of the first string.  On beat three, he played another triplet, going from the fifth fret of the first string to the third fret of the first string followed by either the open first string or the fifth fret of the second string.  On beat four, he played another triplet, going from the third fret of the second string to either the first fret of the second string and the second fret of the third string, or possibly played the middle note of that triplet at the fifth fret of the third string.  He concluded the run hitting the downbeat of the next measure at the second fret of the fourth string.
   * From 1:18--1:22 Lightnin' fretted the following run:  He begins the run on the + of beat four in the ninth bar of the form, doing a thumb hammer at the second fret of the sixth string after striking the open sixth string. In the tenth bar of the form, on 1 + he goes from the open fifth string to the second fret of the third string.  On beat two, he plays a triplet starting at the first fret of the second string, going from there to a grace note slide into the fourth fret of the second string, and from there to the third fret of the first string.  On beat three, he plays a triplet going from the fourth fret of the first string to the fifth fret of the first string and from there to the third fret of the first string.  On beat four, he plays another triplet, going from the open first string to the third fret of the second string, followed by the first fret of the second string, landing on the second fret of the third string on the downbeat of the eleventh bar of the form.
   * Lightnin' most often fretted his IV chord under his singing, in the fifth and sixth bars of his form, at 5-5-4-5-X-5, using a sort of B7 position from the base of the neck moved up three frets, with either his thumb fretting both fifth and sixth strings at the fifth fret, or just the sixth string, or neither, in which case, he would have been using his second or middle finger to mash down and fret both the sixth and fifth strings.  The fingering that Prof Scratchy suggested, 0-4-5-3-5, from the fifth to the first string, is one that was used by other Texas and Oklahoma players, most notably J. T. Smith and Lil Son Jackson.  What struck me about Lightnin's sound on his IV chord in the fifth and sixth bars of the form is that he never once sounds his B or second string, either open, at the third fret or at the fifth fret, all places he might plausibly have chosen to sound it.  Instead, he neither fretted nor sounded the string.

Thanks to all who responded to the puzzler.  Lightin' was sure great.  I will look for another puzzler to post soon.  Incidentally, the post from waxwing that precedes this one was a spoiler when it was originally posted, so I waited until the puzzler had been answered to put it up on the board.
All best,
Johnm
« Last Edit: March 01, 2019, 09:49:25 AM by Johnm »

Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2032 on: March 18, 2019, 12:09:50 PM »
Hi all,
We haven't had a new puzzler for a while,  I've found one--Jimmy Murphy's "Electricity".  Here it is:



The questions on "Electricity" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Jimmy Murphy use to play the song?
   * Describe the bar structure and chord progression, in Roman numerals of Jimmy Murphy's first two solos.

INTRO

Well, you can't see elecitricity a-movin' on the line
How in the world can you doubt it, when you can see it shine?
When you get Salvation, the current, you can feel
You won't have to have nobody, to tell you that it's real

SOLO

Some people don't know the music when they hear it in the air
Some people, they don't know God, when they kneel down in prayer
But let me tell you something and I'm not a-gonna tell you wrong
When you get Salvation, you'll know it by its tone

Well, you can't see elecitricity a-movin' on the line
How in the world can you doubt it, when you can see it shine?
When you get Salvation, now the current, you can feel
You won't have to have nobody, to tell you that it's real

SOLO

Some people don't believe in religion, they think it's all a fake
It's just as real, people, as eating a T-bone steak
It's as sweet as any honey that any bee could make
With a good old sugar molasses and a great big chocolate cake

Well, you can't see elecitricity a-movin' on the line
How in the world can you doubt it, when you can see it shine?
When you get Salvation, now the current you can feel
You won't have to have nobody, to tell you that it's real

SOLO

This old-time Salvation, He gave to me and you
I'm a-feasting on the mountain, like Jesus told me to
I'm a-drinking from God's fountain, that flows from up on high
I'm a-feasting on the mountain where God's fountain won't run dry

Well, you can't see elecitricity a-movin' on the line
How in the world can you doubt it, when you can see it shine?
When you get Salvation, now the current you can feel
You won't have to have nobody, to tell you that it's real

Please use only your ears and guitars to arrive at your answers, and please don't post any responses before 8:00 AM your time on Thursday, March 21.  Thanks for your participation and I hope you enjoy the song.
All best,
Johnm
« Last Edit: March 29, 2019, 03:45:26 PM by Johnm »

Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2033 on: March 22, 2019, 01:30:52 PM »
Hi all,
Any takers for the puzzler on Jimmy Murphy's "Electricity"?  Come one, come all!
All best,
Johnm

Offline banjochris

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Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2034 on: March 22, 2019, 03:00:07 PM »
What a fantastic number! I have never heard of Jimmy Murphy, will have to seek him out.

It's in Vestapol, sort of reminiscent of "Knoxville Blues" and Doc Watson's version of "Train That Carried My Girl From Town."

I'm bad at writing out bar structures, hopefully this is right:

I / / / | IV / I / | I / I / / | II / V / |
I / / / | IV / III / | IV / I / | V (implied) / I

Chris

Edited to fix a couple things.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2019, 11:01:52 AM by banjochris »

Offline Prof Scratchy

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2035 on: March 25, 2019, 11:56:40 AM »
I agree with what banjochris says! I wonder if he played always in Vestapol? The photo accompanying the video, illustrating his capo placement, leads me to think he maybe always did!

Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2036 on: March 29, 2019, 03:33:35 PM »
Hi all,
There have been no responses on the Jimmy Murphy puzzler, "Electricity", in several days, so I'll post the answers.

For Jimmy Murphy's "Electricity":
   * The playing position/tuning was Vestapol, as banjochris and Prof Scratchy had it.  Re Prof's surmise that Jimmy Murphy may have played everything in Vestapol, I thought that was the case, but wasn't sure, so I listened to every track of his that I could find on youtube.  All of his cuts from the '50s were played in Vestapol, and I only found two later-recorded Gospel numbers, one called "Half a Loaf of Bread" and I can't remember the title of the other, in which E position in standard tuning was used, and D in standard tuning was used (though I think the D standard tuning guitar may not have been played by Jimmy Murphy himself).  Chris, you may have heard Mike Seeger play on his old Vanguard album "You Live A Long, Long Time To Get Old", a great Jimmy Murphy number with really sardonic lyrics, which I transcribed many moons ago in the Country Blues Lyrics board, at: https://weeniecampbell.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=2183.msg16889#msg16889.
   * The progression of Jimmy Murphy's first two solos was as Chris had it.  Jimmy Murphy's approach to playing in Vestapol in the left hand was similar to that of Doug Quattlebaum.  Both players favored barre chords over the little three -finger chords at the base of the neck.

Thanks to banjochris and Prof Scratchy for participating, and I'll look for another puzzler to post sometime.
All best,
Johnm
« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 06:47:14 AM by Johnm »

Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2037 on: April 22, 2019, 02:48:15 PM »
Hi all,
It's been a while since we've had a new puzzler, and I have one now for those of you who are interested.  It is from Lonzie Thomas, and it is his version of "A Hard Pill To Swallow".  Here is Lonzie's version of the song:



The questions on Lonzie Thomas's "A Hard Pill To Swallow" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Lonzie Thomas use to play the song?
   * In the course of his rendition, Lonzie Thomas never frets a note higher on the neck than the ____ fret. (Fill in the blank.)

Please use only your ears and your instruments to arrive at your answers, and please don't post any answers before 8:00 AM your time on Thursday, April 25.  Thanks for your participation, and I hope you enjoy the song.
All best,
Johnm
« Last Edit: April 22, 2019, 11:02:47 PM by Johnm »

Offline Prof Scratchy

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2038 on: April 25, 2019, 08:33:02 AM »

* What playing position/tuning did Lonzie Thomas use to play the song? - I'll say EAEGBE tuning, tuned quite low.
* In the course of his rendition, Lonzie Thomas never frets a note higher on the neck than the _4th___ fret. (Fill in the blank.)



Offline Old Man Ned

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #2039 on: April 25, 2019, 12:57:58 PM »
This is a terrific tune. Lonzie Thomas is new to me but I just want to hear more of his playing after hearing this. I'm swithering between E standard tuned a step low and Prof Scratchy's posting of EAEGBE.

I thought E standard at first, but then at about 3:42, to me it sounds like an E chord and the strings all sound open, not fretted. I can't decide. Can I sit on the fence? No, for now I'll go with my initial feeling of E standard.

I'm not getting anything above the 3rd fret though (1st string bent so sounding higher?)

 


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