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Now, the backwater has been dreadful . . . - Walter Davis, West Coast Blues

Author Topic: Miller's Breakdown  (Read 106471 times)

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Offline Dom94

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1950 on: September 15, 2018, 03:50:48 AM »
Hi,
I'm hearing this out of E, but I m pretty sure it s played in Vestapol tuned one step low

the earliest point is at the begining when he plays the main riff











Playin' Blues is Freedom

Offline banjochris

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1951 on: September 17, 2018, 09:28:15 AM »
E standard for sure -- don't have anything to add to how Wax explained it!
Chris

Online Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1952 on: September 19, 2018, 12:12:59 PM »
Hi all,
The Lattie Murrell puzzler on "Blues For Mattie Mae" has been up for a while, and the last response was two days ago, so I will post the answers.  Thanks to all who responded--it really deepens the discussion, so it's nice to have a lot of people participating.

For Lattie Murrell's "Blues For Mattie Mae":
   * His playing position/tuning was E position in standard tuning.
   * I couldn't with absolute certainty at this point identify the playing position as E position in standard tuning, but at the :03 mark, Lattie Murrell plays a double rolled hammer from the flat VII to the major VII up to I.  I was pretty sure he was in E position, standard tuning at that point, subject to it possibly being disproved later on.  This double rolled hammer is right under the left hand in E standard, with the open fourth string the flat VII, the major VII at the first fret of the fourth string, easily hammered by the index finger and the I note at the second fret of the fourth string, easily hammered by the second finger.  The  same double rolled hammer could be played in Vestapol or cross-note, in terms of the pitches, moving from the third fret to the fifth fret on the fifth string, though I have never heard a player in the style utilize that move in either of those tunings.  Similarly, the double rolled hammer could be played in EAEGBE tuning from the fifth to the seventh fret on the fifth string, an even more implausible scenario.  At :14--:16 he plays an ascending bass run from a bIII note on the sixth string third fret to a grace note hammer, from IV to V on the fifth string, from open to the second fret, concluding with a grace note hammer from bVII to I on the fourth string, from the open string to the second fret.  That IV note he hits on the fifth string in the course of that run eliminates Vestapol and cross-note as candidates, and the hammer on the fourth string eliminates EAEGBE as a possibility once and for all.
   * Lattie Murrell played the passage from :11--:14 exactly as a number of you identified it, hitting the open sixth string while brushing the open first string and the bent eighth fret of the second string in the treble.  You're right, Wax, I like that sound, both for its own sake, but also because it is such a distinctive sound, getting the lower note in pitch on a higher string played open, that it is a really helpful device to be able to recognize, every time you hear it.

Thanks to all who participated.  It was great to see how different people sussed out the puzzler.  I will look for another to post soon.
All best,
Johnm

« Last Edit: September 20, 2018, 09:36:35 AM by Johnm »

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1953 on: September 27, 2018, 04:55:44 PM »
Hi all,
I have a new puzzler for those of you who are interested.  It is "Bad Night Blues", as performed by Mott Willis.  Here it is:



The questions on "Bad Night Blues" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Mott Willis use to play the song?
   * Where is Mott Willis fretting the two bends he plays at :06--:07, and where does he fret the note he harmonizes with the bends?
   * Where is he fretting the chord he plays at 1:02--1:03?

Please use only your ears and your instruments to arrive at your answers, and please don't post any answers before 8:00 AM your time on Monday, October 1.  Thanks for your participation, and I hope you enjoy "Bad Night Blues".
All best,
Johnm
« Last Edit: October 10, 2018, 06:48:14 AM by Johnm »

Online Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1954 on: October 02, 2018, 03:08:11 PM »
Hi all,
Any takers on the Mott Willis puzzler?  Come one, come all!
All best,
Johnm

Offline blueshome

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1955 on: October 03, 2018, 06:43:16 AM »
Here we go with tin ear again.
I put the song in G standard, tuned sharp or capoed.
I hear the bend at 3rd fret 3rd string played against the open 2nd string, presumably using an unwound 3rd to get the bend easily.
At 1:02 he plays a D partial from 3rd position

Offline banjochris

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1956 on: October 03, 2018, 01:04:45 PM »
He's in C position, standard tuning; sounds like he's tuned quite low. Have to listen with a guitar in hand to get the rest.
Chris

Offline Prof Scratchy

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Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1957 on: October 04, 2018, 09:41:18 AM »
I make it C too, tuned very low. I think he?s bending the third fret if the second string, and then an abbreviated G chord at 1.02.


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« Last Edit: October 04, 2018, 09:42:23 AM by Prof Scratchy »

Online Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1958 on: October 07, 2018, 10:03:23 AM »
Hi all,
Any other takers for the Mott Willis puzzler?  Come one, come all!
All best,
Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1959 on: October 08, 2018, 10:37:09 AM »
Hi all,
The Mott Willis puzzler has been up for a while and not generated many responses, so I think I will post the answers.

For "Bad Night Blues":
   * Mott Willis' playing position was C position in standard tuning, as banjochris and Prof Scratchy had it, tuned quite low (and thus making extreme bends possible);
   * At :06 and :07, he bends the third fret of the second string up practically a whole step, as Prof Scratchy had it, while fretting the third fret of the first string at the same time.  I don't care how low you're tuned, that takes some real left hand strength, especially that close to the nut, where the strings are tighter.
   * At 1:02--1:03, he hits his turn-around chord, which is a very pretty G7, fretted at 3-0-0-3, from the fourth string to the first string and voiced bVII-R-3-R.

Based on the small sampling of his tunes available on youtube, Mott Willis was a really sophisticated guitar player--don't let his slow tempos fool you--who operated in harmonic territory inhabited by Hacksaw Harney, Eugene Powell, Bo Carter, and very few other Mississippi guitarists of his era who were recorded.  Every one of his pieces that I've heard would be worth figuring out, and he also comes across as a really funny man, with a delivery akin to Pink Anderson's.

Thanks to blueshome, banjochris and Prof Scratchy for participating, and I hope people enjoyed the cut.

All best,
Johnm

 

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1960 on: October 10, 2018, 06:57:07 AM »
Hi all,
I just realized, in the course of entering Mott Willis' "Bad Night Blues" in the index for this thread, that it is the three hundredth song we've taken a look at in this thread.  As Mel Allen used to say, how about that! 
All best,
Johnm

Offline banjochris

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1961 on: October 10, 2018, 10:02:07 AM »
WOW!

Offline Rivers

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1962 on: October 10, 2018, 10:41:15 AM »
Fantastic resource, thanks to all contributors and in particular to Johnm

Offline Slack

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1963 on: October 10, 2018, 11:09:26 AM »
Amazing work Johnm!

Offline Old Man Ned

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1964 on: October 10, 2018, 01:57:47 PM »
That's incredible. Amazing it's hit 300. Thanks so much for this thread John, it's been a huge help to me.