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Sometimes I want to holler, sometimes I want to shout. Sometimes I want to cry, and wonder what about. I think I got the blues - Sonny Terry, I Think I Got The Blues

Author Topic: Miller's Breakdown  (Read 102706 times)

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Offline Lastfirstface

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1875 on: May 01, 2018, 12:54:57 PM »
I whiffed pretty bad in my last couple answers, but here goes:
-E position capoed up
-In verse one he's holding the E chord and rocking between fretting the sixth string at the 4th fret and the sixth string at the 2nd fret. In verse two he fingers the same frets, but on the fifth string instead
-Under the IV chord he plays the open fifth string bass note followed by a plucked note at the 3rd fret followed by a hammer-on to the 4th fret

edited for typos
« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 05:00:31 PM by Lastfirstface »

Offline Old Man Ned

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1876 on: May 02, 2018, 01:24:22 PM »
I'm hearing this in E standard too, capo at around the 4th fret.  I'm struggling with the bass notes though and keep changing my mind. 

My latest thoughts are for verse one, it's rocking between the 4th fret and 2nd fret of the 5th string and verse 2 it's open 4th and 2nd fret of the 5th string, but I'm really struggling to hear this and pin it down. I need to listen more  for what's going on under the IV chord.

Offline Prof Scratchy

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1877 on: May 03, 2018, 08:55:28 AM »
 * What playing position/tuning did Tom Dickson use to play the song? - E capoed to fourth or fifth fret
   * In his first two verse accompaniments, Tom Dickson rocks between two bass notes, falling on beats one and three in the first two measures of the form.  Where are the bass notes located that he rocks between in verse one, and where are the bass notes located that he rocks between in verse two? - 5str 2fr to 6str 4fr in verse 1 and 5str 4fr to 5str 2fr in verse two
   * Where is the bass line located that Tom Dickson plays under the IV chord in his verse accompaniments? - 6str 0fr 5str0 5str 3fr 5str 4fr

Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1878 on: May 07, 2018, 02:52:04 PM »
Hi all,
I'm guessing that everyone who intended to respond to the Tom Dickson "Worry Blues" puzzler has done so by now, so I'll post the answers.

For Tom Dickson's "Worry Blues":
   * His playing position/tuning was E position in standard tuning
   * In the verse one accompaniment, in the first two bars, Tom Dickson rocks between the fourth fret of the sixth string on beat one and the second fret of the sixth string on beat three.  In the verse two accompaniment and all of the subsequent verses, in the same place in the form he rocks between the fourth fret of the fifth string on beat one and the second fret of the fifth string on beat three.
   *  In his verse accompaniments, under the IV chord, in both measures he hits the open fifth string on beat one, hits either the second or third fret of the fifth string on the + of beat two, and picks the fourth fret of the fifth string on beat three. 

Tom Dickson recorded only four titles, all with excellent guitar playing, two in E position, standard tuning and one each in D position, standard tuning and C position, standard tuning.  He seems always to be classified as Memphis musician, but if I recall correctly, none of the Memphis musicians who survived into the '60s and '70s could recall having met him or heard him play.  It seems a long shot that we will get any hard biographical information on him at this late date, but so much information has been turned up in recent years that you never know.

Thanks to all who participated in the puzzler and I hope people enjoyed the song.  I'll look for another one to post.
All best,
Johnm

Offline Thomas8

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1879 on: May 14, 2018, 10:14:37 AM »
Nice overview of the four Dickson sides including lyrics.

http://www.earlyblues.com/WorryBlues.htm

Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1880 on: May 14, 2018, 10:49:28 AM »
Hi Thomas,
Yes, and all four of the Tom Dickson titles have been discussed and transcribed in the Tom Dickson Lyrics thread here. 
All best,
Johnm

Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1881 on: May 15, 2018, 09:14:04 AM »
Hi all,
I have a new puzzler for those of you who are interested.  It is Ranie Burnette's "Lonesome Moon Blues".  Here it is:



INTRO

Don't that moon look pretty, baby, shinin' down through the tree?
Don't that moon look pretty, baby, shinin' down through the tree?
I can see my baby, you know, she can't see me
(Guitar)
I can see my little woman, but, you know, she can't see me
(Guitar)
I see my baby, Lord, you know, she can't see me

Hey, babe, I don't know what to do
I say, hey, baby, I don't know what to do
Lord, she's gone, babe, I don't know what to do

Hey, baby, it's all on account of you
Whoa now, baby, baby, you know it's on account of you
You know, baby, baby, it's all on account of you

The questions on "Lonesome Moon Blues" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Ranie Burnette use to play the song?
   * Where did Ranie Burnette fret the signature lick he plays from :07--:10?
   * True or false:  Ranie Burnette never frets a string lower in pitch than the third string in the course of his rendition.

Please use only your ears and your guitars to arrive at your answers, and please don't post any answers before Thursday morning, May 17.  Thanks for your participation and I hope you enjoy "Lonesome Moon Blues".
All best,
Johnm
« Last Edit: July 06, 2018, 09:09:48 AM by Johnm »

Offline Old Man Ned

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1882 on: May 18, 2018, 12:08:07 PM »
For  "Lonesome Moon Blues" I'm hearing the playing position/tuning as A standard and Ranie Burnette's signature lick  from :07--:10 as, something like:
---------0-3-5-3---------------
3slide5----------5-3-3slide1--
--------------------------------2
all played on the first 3 strings.

True, I don't believe Ranie Burnette ever frets a string lower in pitch than the third string in the course of his rendition. The lowest I'm hearing him go is the A at the 2nd fret of the 3rd string.

Doesn't Ranie Burnette's playing and vocals have a wonderfully relaxed feel?

Offline banjochris

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1883 on: May 18, 2018, 04:01:43 PM »
It sounds to me like he's in Spanish, not A, mostly because of the 0-0-0-0-3-5 chord he plays (although he's not playing all the strings). In A that would be 0-0-2-2-5-5 and it sounds open, not closed, to me. Also he does a pull-off from the first fret of the second string to the open second that would be possible but a little awkward in A. Finally, his bend on the third string sounds to me like it resolves to an open, not a fretted string.

Other than the open 5th string, I don't hear anything below the 3rd string either. Burnette sounds like Lil' Son Jackson was a big influence.
Chris

Offline blueshome

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1884 on: May 18, 2018, 11:00:51 PM »
I hear it as Spanish.
He does play the open 5th string later in the piece.

Offline Prof Scratchy

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1885 on: May 19, 2018, 09:06:20 AM »
The questions on "Lonesome Moon Blues" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Ranie Burnette use to play the song? - Spanish capoed at second fret.
   * Where did Ranie Burnette fret the signature lick he plays from :07--:10? - 2nd str 3; 1st str 3 4 5 0; 3rd str 3b
   * True or false:  Ranie Burnette never frets a string lower in pitch than the third string in the course of his rendition. - I hear the open fifth string at 2.29

Offline Old Man Ned

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1886 on: May 20, 2018, 05:45:27 AM »
Yeah, after reading Banjo Chris's post and listening again it is sounding like he's in Spanish.  I heard that A bass note he hits on the open 5th string and just went off down the wrong road.  Really must learn to contain myself, exercise a bit of restraint, and explore all the possibilities :-)
 

Offline harriet

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1887 on: May 22, 2018, 07:35:31 AM »
I hear spanish.
I hear an open bass 5 throughout.
I heard the run but used transcribe so I will wait to see if its anywhere near what he was playing, if I heard correctly I would like to consider John Lee Hooker's Hobo Blues or Crawling King Snake as a possible influence, both Fred Mcdowell and RL Burnside had versions and used similar notes, that's what I based my study of it on.

Offline WillMo

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1888 on: May 22, 2018, 09:50:02 PM »
Spanish capoed first fret to G#

Ranie was a bit more mentor to RL and learning from Fred.   North Mississippi Hill Country goodness.

I heard a bass G# / 5th string like clock work all throughout but maybe that my thumb.

Good vid from Sunday on playing in this position from Kenny Brown taught Reed Turchi here, 'Skinny Woman':   


Offline Johnm

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Re: Miller's Breakdown
« Reply #1889 on: May 23, 2018, 09:52:03 AM »
Hi all,
The Ranie Burnette puzzler has been up for a while now, so I will post the answers.  Here goes:

For Ranie Burnette's "Lonesome Moon Blues":
   * His playing position was Spanish tuning
   * He played his signature lick from :07--:10 as follows:  The lick starts on beat two of the measure.  On beat two , he plays a triplet, going from a slide into the third fret of the second string followed by the unison open first string, resolving then to the third fret of the first string.  On beat three, he plays another triplet, dividing the middle eighth note of the triplet into two sixteenth notes like so--The first note of the triplet is the fifth fret of the first string, for the middle of the triplet he pulls off from the third fret of the first string to the open first string, and for the third note of the triplet, he plays the first fret of the second string.  For beat four, he hits the third fret of the third string on beat four and the open third string on the + of beat four.
   * It is true that Ranie Burnette never frets a string lower than the third string in the course of his rendition.  He picks the open fifth string, but he does not fret it.  His left hand is a model of economy on this song, for in the course of the song, he only ever frets the third string at the third fret, the second string at the first and third frets, and the first string at the third, fifth and eighth frets. 

Because of this very pared back left hand part, I think "Lonesome Moon Blues" is a great candidate for figuring out by ear--the whole thing.  I would recommend not slowing it down, but being prepared to listen to a given passage as many times as is necessary to figure it out.  My issue with slowing things down to learn them is that I believe it trains your ear to be slow.  When you consider that the universe of choices in the left hand for this song is so small, it shouldn't take too long to figure any portion of the song out.  I would also recommend trying to hear melodic lines and riffs based on where they live in the scale.  When you begin to hear things that way, you can hear runs in any position or tuning, and you just apply the fingering appropriate to that position or tuning.  Taking the signature lick discussed in question two and describing it this way, you end up with the following scalar description of the run:  The beat two triplet goes from a slide into V to a unison V open first string and then up to a bVII in the scale.  On beat three, it goes from a high I note followed by a pull-off from bVII to V followed by a IV note o the second string.  On beat four, it goes from a bIII note on the third string to a low I note on the open third string. 

Once you have that scalar formula for the run, find it and play it in other positions or tunings, play it in E position, standard tuning, A position, standard tuning, Vestapol, etc.  Once you've played the same run in several different keys, positions or tunings you will thoroughly have the sound of it in your head and will find it much easier to locate in a new position or tuning.

Thanks to all who participated in the puzzler; it is your participation that really makes this thread work.  I hope folks enjoyed the song, and it would be great if someone figured out "Lonesome Moon Blues" and posted it on the Back Porch.  I will look for another puzzler to post soon.
All best,
Johnm 
« Last Edit: May 23, 2018, 03:27:20 PM by Johnm »

 


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