Topic: Blind Blake's Guitar Style--Queries and Tips

[Thiago]

Thanks guys, I've taken the decision of getting John Jackson's Homespun video. I'm gonna try pressing the 2 last strings with my ring finger too, but I think it will not work because I have thin long fingers. If that fails, maybe using the thumb does the trick? There is a video on youtube of Rev. Gary Davis performing Candyman, and when he does a G7 chord, he uses the thumb on the 3rd fret of the 6th string, so I think it is possible.

Thiago

[Norfolk Slim]

I genuinely think any adult can do it. My hands arent big (though chubby).  Persistence is the key.  I didnt think I could do it , for a long time.  Keep trying and it will come. Good luck.

[lindy]

but I think it will not work because I have thin long fingers.

I've heard two takes on this from two master players. John Cephas used to talk all the time about "mashin' them two strings"; John had carpenter's hands. But Ari Eisenger--who doesn't have big hands--talks about finding the sweet spot between the 5th and 6th strings that is just enough to get a good tone out of both. Experiment, and give yourself at least a week to feel comfortable with it, one or both notes will definitely sound muddy or muted at the beginning.

Lindy

[LB]

Nice reading, and some good laughs. A comment on the back picking, it reminded me the Book Binder DVD interviewing John Jackson and asking about the two way thumbpicking. That DVD or tape was priceless because Binder did not inject himself into every angle. He was transparent and all John's music and stories, explanations came out perfectly. I don't care what the reason, that is a video worth owning. He really haunts some of those old tunes.

[rylan131]

Blind Blake is dragging the thumb on the bass strings: he starts on 6th and, like an "acciaccatura" stops his thumb on 5th and stay a while on 5th (in classical music is called "appoggiato"), or starts on 6th, drag on 5th and stops on 4th. If you hear old recordings, where there is a bass, acoustic bass playing you can understand what I mean: Blind Blake is playing a kind of bass and a guitar....

[Johnm]

Hi all,
Here is the new Blind Blake Guitar Style merged thread.  I should note where a musician's recorded output has been gone through and identified with regards to playing position/tuning, such threads are being kept separate from the merged thread.  Similarly, announcements of teaching DVDs are not being merged into the threads, even when the DVDs cover the same artists.
All best,
Johnm

[wlhblues]

s anyone here ever tackled West Coast Blues (Blind Blake)

[GhostRider]

Yes. Its a tough one, at the speed he played it.
 Blazing Thumb.

Alex

[wlhblues]

Yes. Its a tough one, at the speed he played it.
 Blazing Thumb.

Alex

How closely do you think you employed the style of Blake?

[banjochris]

Some good info on this topic:
http://weeniecampbell.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=1028.0
Chris

[Kokomo O]

My view is that unless you're superhuman like Ari Eisinger, you shouldn't set as a goal emulating too closely either the style or tempo of Blind Blake. West Coast Blues is actually at base pretty simple for a Blake tune, but the complication comes from the speed and the variations, and the fact that he plays the variations at such wicked speed with such an unbelievable sense of swing. Add in that stumble bass, which is not too tough to do slow but becomes a bear at any kind of speed, and I can only imagine what it's like a Blake speed because I've never been there, and it gets difficult.

But I'm not trying to discourage you, because it's a really fun tune to play, and everyone should learn it. It's an essential part of the rural blues and ragtime guitar repertoire.

[ArthurBlake]

s anyone here ever tackled West Coast Blues (Blind Blake)

Yes my old teacher Brother John Morris had his own TAB of that and I learned it as well as i could off that and he was certainly darn close to being spot on (he usually was) although hard as I tried I had to dump the trick of Blake's where he fingers the C chord and fretting both the bottom C note as well as the bottom G with the third finger whilst also playing the high G on the first string because the guitar I had made it too difficult and I would do some lasting damage to my left hand in trying it. I now find with my Dobro style Gretsch that I may just have a chance to manage it because the neck on this gat is just brilliant. I do believe however that it happens so fast you can sort of "cheat" it. Yes the tune is hard, all Blake songs are very hard I reckon but as for the quick ragtime tunes he played it is one of the easier ones. I don't have John Morris's TAB of it anymore but it was very close to one I have from Stefan Grossman's book.

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I had occasion recently to transcribe Blind Blake's "Hard Road Blues" for a student who wanted a lesson on it and discovered a couple of really interesting things in the course of working on the song.  It is a medium-tempo blues in G position in standard tuning with an underlying triplet feel, in 12/8.  In the third and fourth bars, and to a slightly lesser extent in the seventh and eight bars of his first verse accompaniment, Blake, in addition to maintaining his normal (for him) syncopated bass work and triplet runs in the treble, adds in an interior alternation moving from the open third string to the open second string on beats one, two, three and four.  What is amazing about this, apart from the concept, is that he executes the move in such a way that the interior alternation can be heard clearly as a separate contrapuntal movement through those measures, in addition to the activity in the treble and the bass, and it is not simply an issue of those notes happening to sound simultaneous with the other notes he's picking.  When you consider that this is not the kind of thing that happens by itself--it is thought of and strived for purposefully--it's almost shocking to realize the level of conceptual and technical detail at which Blake was operating.  Hats off!
The other significant thing about this passage, at least from a technical point of view, is that it could not possibly be executed in the right hand via use of only the thumb and index finger to pick.  Blake had to be using at least thumb and two fingers, and in some of his more plucky accompaniments, like "Doin' A Stretch", he sounds like he's using thumb and three fingers.  All stuff to think about, I guess.
All best,
Johnm     

[ArthurBlake]

Hi all,
Your instinct is correct, John C., the DADFAD John M is a different person than me.  John D. and Uncle Bud and John C. have the technique pegged correctly, Col.  It involves going both directions with the thumb to play runs.  I believe Blake did use this technique, but not a lot, certainly not as much as John Jackson did.  There's a place in "Blind Arthur's Breakdown", I believe, where Blake plays a fast run on the A string that goes from open to third to fourth fret several times followed by the same left hand but on the fourth string, where he employs this technique.  Try it out, it's not that hard.  Lemon used the technique, too, but he was wearing a thumpick so it's not exactly the same.
All best,
Johnm
Oh is that what he does there ?, I know the exact part you are talking about and it is the bit where my right hand suddenly goes real tired and wants to end the tune as quickly as possible. Sometimes I mange it sometimes I don't. I have tried to compensate by going to that section earlier than in Blake's recording.
I never even suspected he would be doing this back picking thing but as Blake is in my mind the greatest of all nothing he does would really surprise me much. Thanks mate, you are like a everlasting Kinder Surprise, everytime you unwrap a layer there are more layers underneath.

[ArthurBlake]

There's a place in "Blind Arthur's Breakdown", I believe, where Blake plays a fast run on the A string that goes from open to third to fourth fret several times followed by the same left hand but on the fourth string, where he employs this technique.

I have always thought Blake used a thumb-index combination (or p-i p-i p-i, etc.) for that run.  I listened carefully again several times after reading the above-quoted post, and I don't know that one can make a dispositive aural determination, but I'm still stubbornly inclined to p-i p-i p-i.

Yeah that's the way I try it too, I call it the Gary davis technique even though he certainly didn't invent it but he sure uses it a LOT, it is a great technique and has an attack to it that I love. I think that even if Blake didn't use it or use it much (I think he must have) it is a legitimate way to get around some of his licks and riffs.