Topic: Chords on a couple Sheiks tunes, and one from big chief henry

[SassySam]

Hello,
Anyone out there have a line on the F part in That's It?  I get lost every time, Im sure its fairly easy, but it eludes me.  Also, In I am the Devil, is Bo playing guitar?  It doesnt sound like Walter at all.  Whoever it is, it rocks, what is he doing? 

Also, the Chief- at the end of the C part, he goes on some crazy progression that leaves me far behind. again I think its nothing too weird, but I cant get it.


Thanks!

[frankie]

For That's It, you mean the turnaround part?



That part starts on the IV:  B-flat then an A bass note, then G...  F and walk down to D...  G7, C7, F - it's kind of "wrong" but right.

Sounds like Walter to me on "I Am The Devil" - pretty aggressive, but straightforward playing in G.  One of my favorites.

Can't help on Big Chief Henry without digging some up.

[frankie]

B-flat then an A bass note, then G...  F and walk down to D...  G7, C7, F - it's kind of "wrong" but right.

This is a little easier to understand if you realize that the G chord after the B-flat is standing in for a diminished chord:

B-flat | B-dim | F | D7 | G7 | C7 | F |

and might be a little more recognizable in the key of C, where you may have used it in one of several rags:

F | F#-dim | C | A7 | D7 | G7 | C |

Same progression, different key:

IV | flatV-dim | I | VI7 | II7 | V7 | I |

There's a thread somewhere around here where we discussed all the various ways that various country blues players manage to avoid the diminished chord...

[uncle bud]

Sure sounds like Walter on I Am the Devil to me too. And totally him singing. Guitar is really up front on this recording, and fairly aggressive as Frankie says, with the result being a little more in your face, but it really sounds like his playing to me.

What's the Big Chief Henry song?

Oh, and welcome to WC!

[SassySam]

Oh yes, I forgot to say that I was talking about On the Banks of the Kaney (well, it was obvious to Me at the time...).  Thanks for the welcome and the tips!

[frankie]

I was talking about On the Banks of the Kaney

Just got a chance to listen On the Banks of the Kaney today - I don't hear it as a three-part tune...  just two.  The guitar player is playing in C - haven't checked the actual pitch of the recording.  The first part is 16 bars of C major, repeated twice, and the second part is 8 bars of A minor, repeated twice:

A-part
C /  /  / | C /  / / | C  /  / / | G  / /  / |
G /  /  / | G /  / / | G  /  / / | C  / /  / |
C /  /  / | C /  / / | C7 /  / / | F  / /  / |
F / Ab7 / | C / A7 / | D7 / G7 / | C  / /  / |:

B-part
Am / /  / | Am   / / | E7 /  / / | E7 / /  / |
Am / /  / | Am   / / | E7 /  / / | E7 / Am / |:

I think what you're asking about is the last four measures of the A-part:

F / Ab7 / | C / A7 / | D7 / G7 / | C  / /  / |:

This is basically the same progression that you asked about in That's It, except that the diminished chord is replaced by the Ab7.  Ab7 is used very often in the key of C by many, many rural musicians as a kind of folk-ragtime shorthand for a diminished chord in the key of C - Blind Blake, Gary Davis, Blind Boy Fuller...  the guy that played guitar for the East Texas Serenaders, and whoever's playing the guitar in Big Chief Henry's Indian String Band.  The Ab7 is fingered like this:

e -2-
B -1-
G -1-
D -1-
A -x-
E -x-

If you were Blind Blake, you might even play the A string open, rolling from the open 5th string to the 1st fret of the 4th string with your thumb.

[crustypicker]

i found yes i'm the devil is in G sharp i guess he's most likely tuned low huh? i don't think he's using a capo anyway.great tune though still kinda unsure about the second chord in the intro.

[Cleoma]

Good observation, Frankie, about the similarity between That's It and Banks of the Kaney.  I love the way these rural musicians sidestep the diminished chord.  Who wants that old intervalus diabolus anyways!

[Pan]

i found yes i'm the devil is in G sharp i guess he's most likely tuned low huh? i don't think he's using a capo anyway.great tune though still kinda unsure about the second chord in the intro.

If he is pitched in G sharpp, but plays out of G position, he would be tuned up a half step, I'd say (or using a capo in the 1st fret).

I think the intro is the last 4 bars of a 12 bar blues progression, so the chords in G would be something like

|| D7 | C7 | G | G ||

That is, unless this video isn't missing music played earlier on the song, and starting the song in the middle.



Cheers

Pan

[frankie]

that's right, Pan...  and that's the beginning of the song as I know it. The guitar and fiddle are both playing in the same position on their instruments - G.

crustypicket - A lot of things can inform the pitch of a recording, not the least of which is the fact that a stringed instrument could be tuned to almost any pitch relative to standard tuning. The pitch alone isn't usually particularly persuasive when trying to figure out what position is being used.

[craigmulcahy]

Does anyone know where I can purchase the Big Chief Henry's Indian String Band recordings? Just had a listen to 'On the Banks of the Kaney' on you tube. Blew me away.

[mr mando]

I have "On the Banks of the Kaney" on the Charlie Poole 3CD set with the R. Crumb cover. I don't know if the other tracks recorded by them have ever been reissued.

[crustypicker]

When you go to IV chord in that’s it do you play the full bar chord or is there a different shape they hold?

[crustypicker]

I also have a question about alma waltz. For the guitar does it go I-V-#V then vi? instead of vi (dm) I’ve been playing on the 5th fret x567xx. Don’t know if it’s right but it works.

[Johnm]

Hi crustypicker,
When you post to a thread that has not been posted to in eight years, it's helpful if you tell what tune you're talking about.
All best,
Johnm