Topic: Document getting out of the CD business

[funkapus]

Well, crap.

Document sent out an email this morning indicating that they are leaving the CD business and switching to an entirely digital format.

I understand that marketplace pressures seem to require a move like this if they are to stay alive -- in particular, the email mentions that their U.S. distributor collapsed while owing them money.  But as someone who likes holding the music in my hand, reading liner notes that way, only ever rips to lossless formats when I do rip and only for backup purposes, etc., this is a massive bummer.

[Alexei McDonald]

Me too. But apparently people like us are dinosaurs.

[Adam Franklin]

Me too. But apparently people like us are dinosaurs.

We're not dinosaurs, we're a species that is 'almost' extinct. 

Truly a sad e-mail to receive, I got it yesterday. I've been getting a ton of stuff recently, so helpful, an invaluable service.

All cds at ?1.99, get them while you can.

[Stuart]

We're not dinosaurs, we're a species that is 'almost' extinct. 

Truly a sad e-mail to receive,...

My thoughts exactly, Adam. It certainly was a discouraging e-mail. I agree that there probably aren't enough of us buying re-issue CDs to make it a viable business to be in. Hopefully Document will move beyond the MP3 format and offer their catalog in FLAC and other lossless formats at some point.

I've done business with the retail end of Allegro Music in the past--they're right down I-5 in Portland, Oregon and it looks like their site is still up.  (I ordered Document CDs from them--it looks like some are still available.)

http://www.allegro-music.com/

However, I don't know anything about what went on (and is going on) behind the scenes. It's a cash flow world and ultimately the money has to come from somewhere. My guess is that there just isn't enough of it coming from CD sales of re-issued music like there used to be.

[One-Eyed Ross]

What truly worries me, and I will readily admit to being a Luddite. is that our world is one big solar flare away from the early 1800s.   To me, the loss of vinyl records, and now CDs, while a "good thing" (in that I can carry hours and hours of music on a tiny little MP3 player)....I worry that my grandchildren might wake up one day in a vastly different world.  The loss of music, or literature, because the media has changed (E-books, MP3, etc)....it worries me.  But, l am known to be a Luddite...

[Stuart]

I hear you, Ross. We're one "proper" CME away from the days of old--but  the low tech of the days of old no longer exists as backup. It's all been superseded by...you guessed it.

http://www.npr.org/sections/13.7/2016/04/06/473238503/when-the-sun-brings-darkness-and-chaos

[Adam Franklin]

The biggest problem is not the format, after all we haven't had recorded music for very long, it's that all music has been belittled, it's no longer a pastime or form of entertainment.

As a teacher I've seen a big change in people's attitude to music, adults too. When I suggest they look up music to listen to, it's as if I've asked them to read and memorise the works of Shakespeare. I would say only 20% of my students have any collection of music. I've always taught whatever people want to learn, now I have to suggest tunes/songs.

Bloody spinning jenny.......

A.

[Blind Arthur]

Yes, got the email as well. Throughout the nineties, as a "poor student", I have saved and sent so much (relatively, but also objectively, speaking) money all the time for parcels filled with Matchbox Bluesmaster LPs and 5000-series CDs (paid via "Euroscheck"), weeks of waiting, the thrill, I had Paul Oliver?s Songersters and Saints as guide, underlining each title in my copy of Dixon-Godrich, these CDs are so wonderful and i have spent over ten years studying this and still love it and hear them every day. First via Red Lick, then a local CD shop (now also defunct...) was able to import them for me (with some additional weeks of waiting), that was before the Euro-era (2002), then with the help of my then partn?rs CC card, we could import them direcly. I still remember the record waiting length of my CD shop, thzat record was 5 months for "Ramblin? Thomas and the Dallas Blues Singers" but I didn?t mind then, it was really part of the fun Document really was a discovery for me because musicians I loved, I have always wanted as complete as possible (so I bought also the Ma Raineys just because of the Blake accompaniments) still remember how genuinely "annoyed" I was when finding out that the BBF gospel group titles were (almost all) in an extra issue (as by "Brother George and the Sanctified Singers), a fact which helped me to discover Reverend Gary Davis etc.
Each CD was a new recovery and never a disappointment among them!

[funkapus]

I hear you, Ross. We're one "proper" CME away from the days of old--but  the low tech of the days of old no longer exists as backup. It's all been superseded by...you guessed it.

http://www.npr.org/sections/13.7/2016/04/06/473238503/when-the-sun-brings-darkness-and-chaos

This is actually the field in which I work these days.  But I'm honestly not so worried about the loss of culture that exists in only digital form; if we get whacked by another Carrington Event before we've adequately prepared, we'll have far worse problems.  Without electric power and any ability to restore it for the forseeable future, how long will civilized society exist in a world full of people who have no idea how to get by without it?

[Stuart]

I've been reading about CMEs for decades, but in the last 20 or so years the warnings have been increasingly about the loss, not just of the power grid, but of the data and information that is increasing stored on magnetic and/or electronic media and that is crucial for running much of manufacturing base and the modern tech dependent world. Imagine trying  to reprogram much of our tech dependent world from scratch once the power is restored. It makes the loss of our mp3s insignificant by comparison. Not fear mongering,  but a "word to the wise"...

[Adam Franklin]

"Without electric power and any ability to restore it for the forseeable future, how long will civilized society exist in a world full of people who have no idea how to get by without it?"

This is when I start shouting, "I told you so.....", wearing jeans unencumbered by the the outline of a mobile phone, brandishing a tuning fork.

[eric]

After the next CME, I will down in my bunker with my four milk crates of 78s, my Victor III  and my guitar.  Y'all are welcome to join me, as long as you bring your guitar...

[One-Eyed Ross]

Makes being a poultry farmer and shepherd a worthwhile activity....

[Johnm]

Hi all,
Maybe it is a factor of my age, but I don't see not being able to buy the CDs themselves as being a crucial loss, if the music is otherwise available.  Getting the CDs presupposes that one has the money to purchase the CDs--that certainly is not the case for many of the people who love the music.  Acting like the loss of information is so horrendous also neglects to consider what a relatively brief window in time it has been when all of this music has been relatively easily available.  Somehow or other, people managed to make it through the '60s through '80s when the first wave of Country Blues re-issues occurred, and there might be a period of several years in between instances of a title by a favorite artist being made available again.
Living plants and animals are not the only things that die--cultural artifacts are lost all the time, and music is especially susceptible to being lost.  Before the advent of recording technology, no musical rendition was ever re-heard, except in the minds of those who happened to hear it played the one time it was played.  And I suppose it might be heresy to say it here, but I don't think all of recorded Country Blues is exactly deathless.  A lot of it, especially '30s stuff, just to my taste, is pretty formulaic Pop music of the day.  In general, I've found myself feeling that the more titles a musician recorded, the less important it is that you hear and have all of them.
I see youtube as being hugely beneficial in this regard.  It allows people who don't have the money to purchase the CDs to listen to the music and that's pretty great.  I spent most of my adult life trying to "own" all of the music that I was interested in; I've come to realize that it is more important to me to be able to listen to music than to own it.
All best,
Johnm
 

[Stuart]

Hi John:

Point taken.

IIRC, the printed Document catalog said something to the effect that the purpose of reissuing virtually everything available was in part to aid people doing research. But that was back before downloads became widely available. And Stan Werbin once wrote in the Elderly CD catalog that even if a person could afford it all, s/he'd never have the time to listen to it all. Availability and accessibility (and marketing).

But music isn't just entertainment. To some, it is part of the fabric of social and cultural history (or biography) and is studied as such, in addition to being played and/or simply enjoyed. I'm of the "live and let live, to each his or her own" school on this one. Better to have it and not need it (or not have any interest in it) than to need it and not have it.

I liked when you wrote, "A lot of it, especially '30s stuff, just to my taste, is pretty formulaic Pop music of the day." True enough, but how would we know with any certainty that it wasn't to our tastes if it wasn't available to listen to (if only once)? Reviewers?

Hope to see you Friday night.

Regards,

Stuart