Topic: Miller's Breakdown

[EddieD]

I don't know if I'll get a chance to try these ones Johnm. Hopefully I can get a bit of free time this evening to give them a crack. Too bad I didn't notice this last night, I had the whole night free playing guitar. I was caught up in a whole mess of Blind Blake.

[Old Man Ned]

Thanks for the note about the link to the other posts John.  I'd not noticed that.  I've not had chance to have a look at the last few tunes posted so look forward to catching up with these.

[Johnm]

I have to give Slack credit for coming up with that idea of the linking list, Laurence.  I really like it, too.  It makes it so easy to find whatever song you'd like to hear or study again.
All best,
Johnm

[andrescountryblues]

The questions on "Fare Thee Blues, Part 1" are as follows:
   * What position/tuning did Johnnie Head use to play the song?

C position standard tuning

   * What is the progression of the song, expressed in the key of the position that Johnnie Head used to play it?  Write it out in four-bar phrases if you wish.

C  E7  Am  Adim 
C  C  G7  G7
C  E7  Am  Adim 
C  G7 C  C

Adim being:

-5-
-4-
-5-
-4-
---
---

[Prof Scratchy]

I'd say roig and andres have it right.

[EddieD]

I got a few minutes last night to mess around with these but not near enough as I would have liked. So this is as far as I got with 2 listens to each song:

 "Fare Thee Blues, Part 1" are as follows:
   


* What position/tuning did Johnnie Head use to play the song?
   

standard tuning. C position


* What is the progression of the song, expressed in the key of the position that Johnnie Head used to play it? 
Write it out in four-bar phrases if you wish.

c E7 A F#dim c G C



"Quincey Wimmens":
   
* What position/tuning did Tallahassee Tight use to play "Quincey Wimmens"?
   
D position

I was way off at first...well not really Im starting to understand why the pitch doesnt matter. I was thrown off by the pitch being Eb and retuned my guitar to Eb right away. Capo first fret standard tuning in D position.

* Where did he fret the fill he plays from :30--:33?

Code: [Select]

e-----------
b--333-35-3-
g--444-44-4-
d-----------
a-----------
e-----------
just slide the 34 shape down after that

*the next few sentences was from my original post of playing in E position tuned down half a step*
as you can see I didnt finish that riff. im not even convinced of the tuning/position but this is what I got with the time I had! Also the video for Quincey Wimmens wouldnt play for me so I was going from a document CD with that song. I should get some more time this evening to mess around. I will update my post as I didn't read the other answers yet.*

Edited Quincy Wimmers***

[One-Eyed Ross]

Fare Thee Well is the only one I had time to look into, and the others have it nailed pretty well, as far as I can see.  C, standard tuning.  The chord progression is as others have said, I don't know exactly what dim chord it is, I just play the one that sounds right...Those things have never made sense to me, the way they keep changing names depending on what you want to call it...

[frankie]

Those things have never made sense to me, the way they keep changing names depending on what you want to call it...

Well, diminished chords are an extreme example of it, but ALL chord names are essentially purely contextual...  we just get attached to certain names when they are associated with certain shapes. A chord played thusly:

x32010

might be a rootless Am7 chord in one context... or a C chord in another (again, this example is extreme). It depends on how the chord is functioning relative to the others. This usually falls into some predictable patterns, so we get used to a particular name or another. You can name a diminished chord by any of the tones in it because if you form it correctly, all four tones show up with any of the others (in this case: F-sharp, C, D-sharp, A). The lowest note in the chord played by Johnnie Head is F-sharp, so you could call it F-sharp dim, but calling it A dim would get you the same notes and chord, anyway.

Beyond this, my thoughts on this kind of nomenclature get sketchy and hare-brained, so I'll just clam up while I'm behind!

[eric]

On Fare Thee I got pretty much what andrescountry blues got, but a different dim chord.  I think andres is right.

[EddieD]

 I named the diminished chord F#dim but Adim is the same. I just named it from the top note on the 4th string which is F#. You could name it for any note in the diminished chord itself. Move it up 4 frets and it's the same chord just with the notes in a different order. Move it up 4 frets again and same thing just with the notes in different order. I also didnt put the chords in a 4 barre structure just basically the chords that are used I typed up.

 I'm going to listen to Quincy Wimmers again and see if I can figure it out more. Like I said the video isnt working for me but I have the song on a Document records CD and Im assuming it's the same one.

*I edited quincy wimmers


Waxwing told me it's actually 3 frets you move it. I had my guitar in my hands and Im counting 1, 2, 3, 4.....I was confused until I realized I was holding the F#dim chord and counting that as 1 then each move after it so I was ending up with 4. Thank you for pointing that out Waxwing I have been counting it wrong for quite a while 

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I think all of the responses are in, so I'll post the answers to the "Fare Thee" and "Quincey Wimmens" puzzlers.
For "Fare Thee Blues, Part 1":
   * Johnnie Head did use C position in standard tuning, as I believe all who responded on that tune had it. 
   * The progression of the song, a 16-bar raggy blues is pretty much exactly as andrescountryblues had it--well done, Andres!  We can quibble about the naming of the diminished 7th chord, but as has been pointed out, it could be named by any of the notes that comprised it, and the most common convention has the chord named by its lowest-pitched note, which in this instance is the F# located at the fourth fret of the fourth string.  But since Andres gave the locations of the notes in the chord, its apparent he's talking about the same voicing of the diminished seventh chord that Johnnie Head used.  One nice touch in Johnnie Head's playing of the song is that for his E7 he always voiced the B note on the fifth string on the strong beat, so that he got a nice descending line from C in the C chord to B in the E7 to A in the A minor.  Great kazoo melody too, I've always loved that.
For "Quincey Wimmens:
   * Tallahassee Tight was working out of dropped-D tuning, although he didn't exactly know how to utilize the low D, and hardly used it.  You can hear it a few places in the rendition, at :08, :09, 1:22, 1:55 and a couple of other places.
   * The fill from :30-:33 was played exactly as Roi had it, and his theoretical assessment of it was spot on, too.  It is a common G turn-around, and in a way, only makes sense if resolved to G since the penultimate place in the walk-down, 2-1 on the third and second strings, is a D7 chord, which is a dominant seventh chord, wanting to resolve to G.  By resolving to D, he sets up a musical momentum and then squelches it, returning to where he started. 
"Quincey Wimmens" is an interesting track.  Tallahassee Tight in some ways sounds like he doesn't know what he's doing, but he plays a lot of nice ideas.  He also gets credit for one of the great similes in blues lyrics:  "She got ways like a terrapin".  Wow, how so?

Thanks for participating and I'll post another puzzler soon.
All best,
Johnm

[frankie]

Tallahassee Tight in some ways sounds like he doesn't know what he's doing, but he plays a lot of nice ideas. 

He definitely doesn't seem encumbered by knowledge!

He also gets credit for one of the great similes in blues lyrics:  "She got ways like a terrapin".  Wow, how so?

Actually, I was wondering if he was singing 'Terraplane'...

[Johnm]

I think it is 'terrapin", Frank, after re-listening many times.  Checking on Wikipedia, I found that the Terraplane was released by Hudson for the first time in 1934, the same year this song was recorded, so I suppose it's possible that if Tallahassee Tight was a "now" kind of guy, he might have picked up on that and cited it in his song.  He seems pretty Country, though.
All best,
Johnm

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I'm having a tough time coming up with the lyrics for Tallahassee Tight's "Quincey Wimmens" in this thread, and most especially the first lines to his verses.  The performance can be found at:  http://weeniecampbell.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=10188.msg92354#msg92354 , and I'd very much appreciate help with the lyrics.
all best,
Johnm

[EddieD]

Man that first line is hard to make out. Sounds like maybe it's " Had a little Quincy women, sure good baby"