Topic: Miller's Breakdown

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I have a couple of new puzzlers for you, both from Big Bill Broonzy, who is somewhat neglected nowadays, it seems.  The first tune is "Stove Pipe Stomp", and here it is:



The questions on "Stove Pipe Stomp" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Bill Broonzy use to play the tune?
   * Where did he fret the little bass run with which he transitions from his IV chord back to his I chord at :07--:08?
   * Where did he fret the bass runs he plays over his I chord from 1:15--1:19?

The second Broonzy song we'll be taking a look at is "Stump Blues".  Here it is:



The questions on "Stump Blues" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Big Bill use to play "Stump Blues"?
   * Explain how his signature lick sits in the pulse and describe where it is fretted.
   * What is he fretting for his IV chord, under his singing?

As always, please use only your ears and your instruments to arrive at the answers to the questions, and please don't post your answer until 8:00 AM your time on the morning of Monday, September 7.  Thanks for your participation, and I hope you enjoy Big Bill's songs.
All best,
Johnm

[Prof Scratchy]

I'm going to guess dropped D tuning for Stove Pipe Stomp. When I say dropped D, it's hard to be certain, because of the way Big Bill mutes the 6th string. If it is dropped D, then that transitional bass slide could be from the second to the fourth fret of the sixth string (though I'm not sure that's right). For the bass riff I have 4str/bend 3>pull off 3>0; 5str/2> 4str/0





Stump blues E

double time on muted  bass
e string over which he plays in single time pinched open 6 and first str, then 3fr 2 str > open 2 str> open 3 str hammer on 1fr 3str>2fr 4 str

[Old Man Ned]

For Stove Pipe Stomp I'm going for D standard.  What's pulling me to standard tuning rather than Dropped D is around the 47 sec mark I'm hearing a slide into the F sharp on the 6th string, followed by an open 5th string, which, if I'm hearing that right would be an easier fit to play than a slide from the 3rd to 4th fret if it were dropped D tuning.  Plus in other places I'm hearing the F sharp without the slide and am figuring it's just played by hooking the thumb over the neck at the 2nd fret.

The wee bass run between 07:08, is that just a slide up to the 5th fret on the 6th string from the 3rd fret, followed by an open 5th string? Between 1:15 - 1:19 I'm hearing:
on 4th string: bent at 3rd fret, 2nd fret pull off to open string.  5th string, 2nd fret; 4th string open, then bent at 3rd fret x2, 2nd fret pull off to open string.  5th string, 2nd fret; 4th string open.  This is repeated.
The above is a sort of simplified version as I'm hearing a bit more going on in their but haven't got to the bottom of it yet.

Stump blues I'm hearing in E standard. The closest I've come to the signature lick is:
0  - 0 0 -  -  - - -
-  - -  - 2  0 -  - -
-  - -  - -  -  1 - -
-  - -  - -  -  - 2 -
-  - -  - -  -  - -  -
0 0 0 - 0  0 0 0 0

Though not too confident I've got the open 6th string bass notes (pulse?) in the right place.  The fretting over the IV chord, Is this just a boogie pattern around the A chord barred at the 2nd fret?

[Johnm]

Hi all,
Any other takers for the Bill Broonzy puzzlers, "Stove Pipe Stomp" and "Stump Blues"?  Come one, come all!
All best,
Johnm

[ScottN]

Nothing really new to add but I'll cast a vote for Stove Pipe Stomp being in D standard tuning.

I'll vote for Stump Blues in E based primarily on the hammer to the G# on the third string as a lick common to that position - plus the signature lick sounds remarkably close to Shirley Griffith's ending lick in River Line Blues.

And a brief comment - what an incredible voice!

Thanks,
            Scott

[Lastfirstface]

I concur with previous posters:

Stove Pipe Stomp - D standard
Stump Blues - E standard

[Prof Scratchy]

I'm going to ditch dropped D and go for D standard too. Still can't get that bass sllide to sound just right though! On Stump Blues, I forgot to say that under the singing for IV chord he's slapping down on the open 5th, then 5th at fourth fret> 4th at 2nd fret, then back to 5th at 4th fret. He rocks this sequence under his vocal.

[ScottN]

Stump Blues

Yes I'm sittin on this old stump baby got a worried mind
Yes I'm sittin on this stump baby I've got a worried mind
Yeah I'm gonna find my baby Lord or lose my life a tryin

Yeah I shot five dollars caught a point like nine
Yes I shot five dollars even I caught a point like nine
Yeah I stopped that six bar baby and that trey come flyin

Yeah I hear my hamstring a poppin my collar cryin
Lord I hear my hamstring a poppin baby 'n I hear my collar cryin
Now how can I stay a happy Lord when my baby's down the line

Yeah you never get to do me like you done my buddy Shine
No you'll never get to do me like you done my buddy Shine
You know you worked him down the levy until he went real stone blind


Thanks,
            Scott

[banjochris]

On "Stove Pipe," Bill also often walks or slides from F# to G on the 6th string right before playing the IV chord section, which would be damn awkward in drop D, so standard D is my vote as well. (You can hear the walk up right after the "bass lick" part especially.) He also does a thumb drag from the G to the B on the 5th string quite a bit. The "bass lick," which Ned described earlier, is the same lick Bill plays with a flat pick in "I Can't Be Satisfied."

[Prof Scratchy]

He also does a thumb drag from the G to the B on the 5th string quite a bit./i]

?
Now I'm further foxed...Would really like to learn this one though, so roll on Johnm's answer!

[banjochris]

He also does a thumb drag from the G to the B on the 5th string quite a bit./i]

?
Now I'm further foxed...Would really like to learn this one though, so roll on Johnm's answer!

To clarify, I meant from the G on the 6th string to the B on the 5th, just the normal bottom of a G chord.
Chris

[Johnm]

Hi all,
Thanks for your responses, and I think as many people as intended to respond have done so, so I'll post the answers.

For "Stove Pipe Stomp":
   * Playing position was D position in standard tuning as Old Man Ned had it, and everyone else ended up choosing as well--well done!  Just as a matter of interest/question, I'm not aware of any recordings of Big Bill Broonzy playing in dropped-D tuning.  He was very prolifically recorded, though, and there are large portions of his recorded repertoire that I've never heard.  Does anyone know of anyone recordings of his that are in dropped-D?  If anyone could post such a recording, or a link to one, I'd be most interested.  In making the identification for "Stove Pipe Stomp", the two factors that argue most decisively for D in standard tuning versus dropped-D are:
   1) He never hits a low D note on his sixth string in the bass; and,
   2) He consistently voices his IV chord as a G7 with its root in the bass and fingering its seventh at the first fret of the first string, while also catching the third fret of the second string in the G7.  Such a combination of notes sits very naturally in D standard, where you can get the third fret of the sixth string with the third finger, the second fret of the fifth string with the second finger, the third fret of the second string with the little finger and the first fret of the first string with the index finger.  In dropped-D, the same combination of notes becomes very implausible in terms of the reaches that would be involved in the left hand.  The thumb roll that Big Bill plays, from G on the sixth string to B on the fifth string that banjochris alluded to can be heard at :20, :35 and elsewhere throughout the course of the song, and would be right awkward to play in dropped-D tuning, too.
   * At :07-:08, Big Bill transitions from his IV chord back to his I chord by sliding from the third fret of the sixth string to the fourth fret of the sixth string on beat 4+ of the sixth measure of his form, landing on the open fifth string with his thumb in the right hand on the downbeat of the seventh bar, thus voicing his I chord, D, with its fifth, A, in the bass there.  This is pretty much exactly as Old Man Ned had it, so well done, Ned!
   * From 1:15 to 1:19, Big Bill is playing over the first four bars of his form, all on the I chord.  He starts his bass runs on beat 2 of the first bar, bending the fourth string at the third fret.  On beat 3 of that bar, he plays a triplet, pulling off from the second fret of the fourth string to the open fourth string and then hitting the second fret of the fifth string.  On 4+, he goes from the open fourth string to the second fret of the fifth string.  The second bar is the same as the first, except that instead of having a rest on the first beat, Big Bill bends the third fret of the fourth string.  The third bar is the same as the second bar, except Big Bill substitutes an open fourth string for the first beat.  The fourth bar is the same as the second bar, except Big Bill substitutes the second fret of the sixth string for the second fret of the fifth string on the + of beat 4, sliding from that second fret of the sixth string on the + of beat 4 up into the third fret of the sixth string for the downbeat of the fifth bar, where the IV chord arrives.  That movement from the second fret of the sixth string up into the third fret of the sixth string is the F# to G movement that Chris alluded to.  For his bass runs in the first four bars, Big Bill gets a crisp rhythmic emphasis by always dragging his thumb from a lower string into the next higher string, where that happens, in one continuous motion, rather than winding up and using two discrete motions for the different strings.  Using two motions would be too slow, but even if it were in time, the sound would be much more choppy and have less flow.

For "Stump Blues"
   * Playing position was E in standard tuning as all had it--well done!
   * Big Bill plays a monotonic bass on the open sixth string for his signature lick, in double time, hitting 1+2+3+4+ with his thumb, as Prof Scratchy had it.  Because he is hitting eighth notes in his bass, Big Bill works with smaller subdivisions of the time in the treble.  He hits the open first string on the + of beat 1.  His beat two timing is very syncopated--he hits the open first string on the sixteenth note in between 1 and +, and re-hits the open first string on the sixteenth note in between the + of beat 2 and beat 3.  On beat 3, he plays two pinches in the treble against the open sixth strings on 3 +, going from the second fret of the second string to the open second string.  On beat 4 +, he hits two pinches as well, going from a double rolled hammer to the first fret of the third string on beat 4 and resolving to the second fret of the fourth string on the + of beat 4.  This is substantially as Old Man Ned had it.  I should say that licks like this sit so naturally in the left hand that they are most often easier to pick up by ear than by using a description of how the move is executed.
   * Under his singing over the IV chord, Big Bill played just what Prof Scratchy had:  a boogie bass in A with a kind of
1 +a 2 +a 3 +a 4 +a rhythm, hitting the open fifth string on beat 1, the fourth fret of the fifth string on beat 2, the second fret of the fourth string on beat 3 and returning to the fourth fret of the fifth string on beat 4.  On the "+a" portions of the lick, he does a little down up strum of his A chord, emphasizing the third and second strings.

Thanks to Scott for locating a video of Big Bill playing "Stump Blues" and for transcribing the lyrics.  Here is the video, noting that in this version, Big Bill sometimes hits the third fret of the second string rather than the second fret of the second string on beat three of his signature lick:



Thanks to all who participated.  I hope you enjoyed the tunes and figuring out how Big Bill played them.  I'll look for more good candidates to post as puzzlers in the near future.

All best,
Johnm

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I have a couple of new puzzlers for those of you who are interested.  The first is Kokomo Arnold's "Sister Jane Cross The Hall".  I don't usually think of slide players as being dance musicians, but Kokomo Arnold sets that idea on its head.  Man, could he groove!  Here is his performance:



Says, old Sister Jane, right 'cross the hall, she got good stuff but no mule in her stall
REFRAIN: Old Sister Jane, right across the hall
Oh, she drinks her liquor and she sure, God, has a ball

She smokes cigars and cigarettes, too, she don't do nothin' but ballyhoo
REFRAIN: Old Sister Jane, right across the hall
Oh, she drinks her liquor and she sure, God, has a ball

Let's go to the drug store and get some wine, come back to Sister Jane's, have a whompin' good time, at
REFRAIN: Old Sister Jane's, right across the hall
Oh, she drinks her liquor and she sure, God, has a ball

Now, come on, boys, get up and shout,'cause none of you know what it's all about, 'cause
REFRAIN: You ask Sister Jane,right across the hall
When she drinks her liquor you know she got to have a ball

SOLO

Now, guess I've nixed out and caught my broom, for I done got drunk but I ain't got no room
REFRAIN: Over to Sister Jane's, right across the hall
Oh, she drinks her liquor and she sure, God, has a ball

She got a kitchenette and apartment, too, she don't do nothing but ballyhoo
REFRAIN: Old Sister Jane's, right across the hall
Oh, she drinks her liquor and she sure, God, has a ball

Now, when I'm 'sleep I lay flat on my back,you come in drunk with some of your wise old cracks, from
REFRAIN: Sister Jane, right across the hall
When she gets full of her liquor, you know she got to have a ball

Now, her build is like a big ship at sea,you're always duckin' and dodgin' poor me
REFRAIN: Over to Sister Jane's, right across the hall
Oh, she drinks her liquor and she sure, God, has a ball

SOLO

The questions on "Sister Jane Cross The Hall" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Kokomo Arnold use to play the song?
   * Where does Kokomo Arnold fret the fills he plays from :12--:13 and from :15--16?  How does the pitch vary slightly between the two fills and what is the difference in the chords underneath the two fills that might help to explain the difference in pitch?
   * Where does Kokomo Arnold fret the "down-and-back" chordal fill he plays from :27--:29?
   * Where does Kokomo Arnold fret the note he is leaning on at the beginning of his solo, from 2:19--2:23, and what is the note relative to the chord over which it is played?

The second puzzler is Arthur Crudup's "Death Valley Blues", one of his few recordings I've heard on which he played an acoustic guitar.  Mr. O'Muck's posting of Crudup's "Mean Ol' Frisco Blues" in the "SOTM" thread reminded me how little of Arthur Crudup's material has been figured out and played as he played it.  Here is "Death Valley Blues":



I went down in Death Valley, ain't nothin' but tombstones and dry bones
I went down in Death Valley, nothin' but tombstones and dry bone
That's where poor me'll be, Lord, when I'm dead and gone

Now, if I should die, and should die before my time
Baby, if I should die, and should die before my time
I want you to bury my body down by that 'Frisco line

Now, bury me, mama, low down in the sand
Ahh, bury me, mama, low down in the sand
Now, bury me, mama, where I won't bother your next old man

Ahhhh, bye-bye, baby, I said good-bye
Ahhhh, bye-bye, baby, I said good-bye
Death Valley is my home, mama, when I die

Tell all these women, please come dressed in red
Tell all these women, please come dressed in red
They goin' down on 61 Highway, that's where the poor boy, he fell dead

Wear your patent leather slippers, mama, put on your morning gown
Wear your patent leather slippers, put on your morning gown
You gwonna follow poor Crudup, down to his buryin' ground

The questions on "Death Valley Blues" are:
   * What playing position/tuning did Arthur Crudup use to play the song?
   * Where are the two notes that he is rocking back and forth in the bass between :32--:35 found on the fingerboard?
   * Where did Arthur Crudup fret the run he plays from :50--:53?
   * Where did Arthur Crudup fret his "secret weapon" chord which he plays at 1:18, 1:21, 2:20 and 2:22?
   * Where on the fingerboard is the note found which Arthur Crudup is leaning on in the bass under his IV7 chord from 2:58--3:01?

Please use only your ears and your instruments to answer the questions, and please don't post any answers before 8:00 AM your time on Monday, September 14.  Thanks for your participation, and I hope you enjoy the songs and figuring out what Kokomo Arnold and Arthur Crudup were doing.  Remember, you need not answer all the questions, just the ones you're inclined to answer.
All best,
Johnm
   

[Prof Scratchy]

Tough ones!

  * What playing position/tuning did Kokomo Arnold use to play the song? Vestapol
   * Where does Kokomo Arnold fret the fills he plays from :12--:13 and from :15--16?  How does the pitch vary slightly between the two fills and what is the difference in the chords underneath the two fills that might help to explain the difference in pitch? 1str 3>2>0;2str 2>1str 0; first riff is on top of IV chord; second riff is on top of I chord
   * Where does Kokomo Arnold fret the "down-and-back" chordal fill he plays from :27--:29? - xxx120>xxx210>xx120
   * Where does Kokomo Arnold fret the note he is leaning on at the beginning of his solo, from 2:19--2:23, and what is the note relative to the chord over which it is played? - slide into 9th fret of first string

 * What playing position/tuning did Arthur Crudup use to play the song? - Crossnote
   * Where are the two notes that he is rocking back and forth in the bass between :32--:35 found on the fingerboard?      -6th and 5th str open x2>open 6th str and 5th str 2nd fr x2;open 6th and 5th x1
   * Where did Arthur Crudup fret the run he plays from :50--:53? -pass!
   * Where did Arthur Crudup fret his "secret weapon" chord which he plays at 1:18, 1:21, 2:20 and 2:22? - 0xx78b0
   * Where on the fingerboard is the note found which Arthur Crudup is leaning on in the bass under his IV7 chord from 2:58--3:01? - 6th string 4th fret?

[Johnm]

Hi all,
Any other takers for the Kokomo Arnold and Arthur Crudup puzzlers?  Come one, come all--answer only the questions you wish.
All best,
Johnm