Topic: Adventures in Vestapol

[Slack]

Welcome Pat!

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I just thought of a tune that fits this category, John Byrd's "Old Timbrook Blues".  John Byrd was one of the rare 12-string players who was not from Georgia.  He was from Mississippi, and also backed Geeshie Wiley on at least one number.  "Old Timbrook Blues" is a horse song, like "Stewball", and also like "Stewball", there are versions in both the African-American and Old-Time traditions--Bill Monroe recorded "Molly and Tenbrooks".  The version I have of "Old Timbrooks Blues" is from an old OJL anthology, "Country Blues Encores", but I don't know where it is available on CD.
All best,
Johnm

[wildcotton]

How about John Hurt's "O Mary, Don't You Weep"?   I've always played in in vestapol--I'm pretty sure he does, too.

Jeff

[Johnm]

Hi Jeff,
Does John Hurt have a version recorded other than the one on "Worried Blues"?  The reason I ask is because that version is played out of E, standard tuning.  I will try it in Vestapol--I can hear how it would work.
All best,
Johnm

[blueshome]

John Byrd's Old Timbrook is on the JSP Paramount Masters collection.

[wildcotton]

Johnm,

I'm referring to the one on the D.C. Blues Lib. of Congress CD.  Sounds like vestapol to me.  Listen and see what you think. I'll give the "Worried Blues" version a listen.

Jeff

[Easy Rider]

Let me add the following songs that I do:

Mississippi John Hurt:  "Payday", "If You Don't Want Me"

Dave Van Ronk:          "Bad Dream Blues"  (capo at 4)

Trad:                        "Goin' Down the Road Feelin' Bad"  (from a Harry Taussig book)

[Jeff in Montana]

Just one more to add to the list ( I don't think anyone mentioned it), how about - Doc Watson's "Sitting On Top of the World".  Been trying to play it myself ala Grossman's Country Blues in Open Tunings book/Cd package.  Fun tune and fun tuning!

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I just found a good tune to add to the Vastapol list--Scott Dunbar's "Memphis Mail", from his "From Lake Mary" disc on Fat Possum.
All best,
Johnm

[Hamhound]

Backtracking just a little...
johnm wrote

a tune that fits this category, John Byrd's "Old Timbrook Blues".  John Byrd was one of the rare 12-string players who was not from Georgia.  He was from Mississippi, and also backed Geeshie Wiley on at least one number.

Do you know which Geeshie Wiley tune John?  John Byrd sounds interesting - must investigate!

The version I have of "Old Timbrooks Blues" is from an old OJL anthology, "Country Blues Encores", but I don't know where it is available on CD

blueshome points out that it's on the JSP Paramount Box Set - also seems to be available (?) on Story of The Blues with sides by Walter Taylor. (SB-3517  John Byrd & Walter Taylor 1929-1931) where both men are described as Kentuckians.(?)

Sorry, have said nothing whatsoever about Vastapol     Finish.

[dj]

Do you know which Geeshie Wiley tune John?

Blues & Gospel Records has the accompaniments on all of Geeshie Wiley's surviving sides as by Wiley herself. 

John Byrd did accompany Mae Glover on 5 sides, one of which was unissued.  These are on Document CD 5185, "Mae Glover".  Byrd's solo sides and his accompaniments to Walter Taylor (Washboard Walter) are on Document CD 5614, "Rare Country Blues, Volume 2".  The latter CD is on the Juke.

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I think I obtained my information about John Byrd backing Geeshie Wiley on "Eagle's On A Half" from an early Yazoo release, where that theory was posited in the notes.  Going back and listening again, I do think it is Geeshie accompanying herself, and a pretty stellar job it is, too.
All best,
Johnm

[Bunker Hill]

I've resurrected this thread in light of something I've stumbled upon in Jazz Monthly, July 1960. Not being a musician, just a fan, it may be all a load of hogwash but think it interesting that in 1959 (or maybe earlier) Oliver had actually heard Gabriel Brown's LoC recording "Talking In Sebastopool" to be able to discuss it. FWIW, here goes:

Talking in Sebastopool
A number of readers have asked me the meaning of the above title and what is "an authentic example in Sebastopool tuning" to which I made reference in the piece on Gabriel Brown, "Blow Gabriel" (JM Nov. 1959). I could have worded this better, for whilst I knew of a number of items which appear to be in Sebastopool tuning, this would be one of the few actually titled as such. Sebastopool tuning, or as Elizabeth Cotton calls it on her Folkways LP somewhat more accurately ? "Sevastapol tuning" ? is a method of tuning the guitar which is reputedly of Russian origin and introduced to the States by Russian emigrees. For the folk musician it has many advantages, for it is simpler to play than the customary tuning of the guitar, and a blues singer can perform in the favourite blues key of "E" with remarkably little instrumental knowledge. It is, of course, a limited means and for the accomplished guitarist has little appeal. Instead of the customary Bass E, A, D, G, B, Top E tuning of the guitar the performer raises the "A" string to "B"; the "D" string to "E" and the "G" string to G sharp, leaving the "B" and "E" strings as before. The guitar is now tuned to an open "E" chord and when strummed, plays as if the frets were stopped for "E" in the normal tuning. The blues singer needs only to strum for the first four bars, stopping the "B" string with one finger for the concluding "Seventh"; needs only a couple of fingers to form his "A" and "B 7th" chords and for three quarters of the total sequence of the twelve-bar blues, need do nothing but strum if he feels so inclined. This hardly lends itself to instrumental variety, however! Still, it does free the fingers of a non-too-dexterous guitarist to play some melodic variations, and is especially successful when the knife-blade or bottleneck of the folk guitarist is laid across the strings. More guitarists than might be supposed use this tuning as Brownie McGhee demonstrated at my home whilst on his last trip (photograph p.27).

He showed how a singer such as Tommy McClennan or Bukka White can use this to powerful effect, but also, much more surprisingly, Robert Lee McCoy. "Yeah, it's good for some and can learn a man to play the blues...but for me it don't have enough" said Brownie, resting his left and idle arm on his knee, turning away his head to show his disinterest...and thumb-and-finger picking a swift and fascinating accompaniment that many a blues man has never achieved.

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I just recalled another Vestapol song--Uncle Dave Macon's "I've Got The Mourning Blues", on which he was accompanied by Sam McGee.  Sam's instrumental "Guitar Waltz" was also played in Vestapol.
All best,
Johnm

[Johnm]

Hi all,
I've been listening a lot lately to religious material from two reasonably new sets on JSP:  "Blind Willie Johnson and the Guitar Evangelists" and "Rev. Gary Davis and the Guitar Evangelists, Vol. 2".  Each of the sets is notable for including, in addition to the complete early recorded works of the featured artist, the complete recorded works of an additional artist who recorded prolifically.  The Johnson set includes the complete recordings of Rev. Edward W. Clayborn and the Davis set includes the completed recordings of Joe Taggart.  It is all music worth having and, as usual with JSP, the price is certainly right. 
Anyhow, I noticed when listening to Blind Willie Johnson the other day that a major portion of his recorded repertoire apart from his slide numbers was played in Vestapol.  This category of songs, which without listening very carefully in the past, I had always assumed was played out of F in standard tuning. I noticed a commonality to the left-hand approach the other day, though, in that everything in these songs is free-handed, no chordal shapes are used or played and the first two strings drone throughout the song.  The right hand is flat/thumb-picked with great force, phrasing melody primarily on the fifth and sixth strings.  The sound of the open chord is voiced from sixth to first string:  Root-5th-Root-3rd-5th-Root, which is the way both Vestapol and F in standard tuning are voiced.  The primarily major pentatonic scale that these songs use sits so easily in Vestapol:  5th--open fifth string, 6th--second fret, fifth string, Root--open fourth string, 2nd--second fret, fourth string and 3rd--fourth fret fourth string. 
The songs employing this approach are as follows.  For each tune, I'll list the recording date and pitch.

   * If I Had My Way I'd Tear This Building Down--12/3/27, F
   * I'm Gonna Run To The City Of Refuge--12/5/28, G
   * Jesus Is Coming Soon--12/5/28, G
   * When The War Was On--12/11/29, Eflat
   * Take Your Burden To The Lord And Leave It There--12/11/29, Eflat
   * The Rain Don't Fall On Me--4/20/30, F
   * Trouble Will Soon Be Over--4/20/30, F
   * The Soul Of A Man--4/20/30, E
   * Everybody Ought To Treat A Stranger Right--4/20/30, F
   * John The Revelator--4/20/30, E

I think these songs are a particularly strong portion of Blind Willie's repertoire.  His time is so strong and punchy on these numbers, and for whatever reason, the vocal interplay between Angeline and him is especially powerful and effective.  It's ironic that everyone associates Blind Willie Johnson's slide playing with Vestapol, and it just occurred to me that he was using Vestapol for this large portion of his non-slide repertoire as well.  It's a great sound.
All best,
Johnm