Topic: Adventures in D position, standard tuning

[Johnm]

Hi all,
A couple of others played in D position, standard tuning:
   * Santa Fe Blues--Smith Casey
   * Airy Man Blues--Papa Charlie Jackson
All best,
Johnm

[frankie]

I was learning Blind Willie McTell's 'Stole Rider Blues' last year . . . that has some real nifty ideas out of D position (drop D?)

That one is in Drop-D, but you're right about the song - really neat stuff going on, particularly over the IV chord.

[blueshome]

William Harris - West Side Blues

[banjochris]

Hi all,
A couple of others played in D position, standard tuning:
   * Santa Fe Blues--Smith Casey
   * Airy Man Blues--Papa Charlie Jackson

Papa Charlie's "Shake That Thing" also.
Memphis Minnie - "Banana Man Blues"
Chris

[Johnm]

Waxwing, just as you say, I believe all of Scrapper's D tunes were in D position, standard tuning rather than Dropped-D tuning--at least all of the D tunes he recorded.  And his tactic of raking the bottom three strings in D with the thumb wrapped F# on the sixth string certainly got the position out of the top-heavy sound it might otherwise be prone too, in addition to being an extremely powerful way of playing time.  He really was such an ace!
All best,
Johnm

[waxwing]

Agreed. An ace! Particularly in the Key of D. I wish I had more time and energy to donate to your lesson on his postwar "Blues in E" to see what he was up to there. But my aging hands seem to require so many more repetitions these days just to remember a simple passage. The struggle goes on, with too little time and energy.

But the more I think about your mandate for this thread:

Maybe as the thread goes along we can discuss why that may have been so, what D position gives you, and what it makes unavailable to you.

I feel that "Back Door Blues" really does exhibit a lot of what D position offers, at least to someone with the imagination of a Scrapper Blackwell. And not just in the D chord, as I've already mentioned and more. In the IV chord, G, he has some terrific ideas: In the first few pass throughs, working with a 32303x G7, he lifts the bass, not to an open 6th string E as one might in G, but to the thumb wrapped F# again; And then in the solo, using the same 32303x G7, the lovely syncopated double stop walk down, holding the 2nd and 4th string at the 3rd fret with ring and pinky, playing xxx2x1 (with index and middle), xxx0x0, xx3x3x, several times, but then in the 3rd and 4th verses plays essentially the same walk down on the 2nd and 4th string, but with an on the beat rhythmic feel, xxx7x6x, xxx5x5x, xxx3x3x, xxx0x0x, to the D chord, possibly to get clean damping between each double stop. Also the idea of bending the m3rd toward the M3rd and the m7th toward the M7th at the 3rd fret of the 4th and 5th strings, all the fretting needed for 1st two measures of the solo while holding the partial D on the 2nd and 3rd strings, is simplicity itself. And yet in his other songs in D he utilizes entirely different ideas. Truly amazing!

Wax

[Johnm]

Hi all,
One player for whom D position in standard tuning was a favorite position was Memphis Willie B.  On his two Prestige Bluesville albums he recorded a host of tunes that he played out of D position in standard tuning, including:
   * Bad Girl Blues
   * Car Machine Blues
   * Overseas Blues
   * Good Potatoes
   * Funny Caper Blues
   * Grief Will Kill You
   * P 38 Blues

Baby Tate did not record a lot of titles played out of D position in standard tuning, but the one he did, "When Your Woman Don't Want You Around", is spectacular, and he gets around in the position with tremendous flair and invention.  I don't believe the performance is up on youtube, and if I can't find it, I'll post an .mp3 of it.
All best,
Johnm

[banjochris]

Leadbelly is another standard D player (if you can call his tuning standard!) -- I would guess that retuning the 12 would be a pain, plus he'd lose that nice big G on the bottom of this IV chord.
Chris

[Johnm]

Good point re Leadbelly, Chris.  Another thing about him is that he would sometimes play thumb lead out of D position in standard tuning, as on his version of "House of the Rising Sun", something Maybelle Carter never did once in the entire Carter Family recorded repertoire.  She's another player who eschewed D position altogether, at least on her recordings.
All best,
Johnm

[EddieD]

While there is no recorded version of this song that I know of, Ernie Hawkins teaches Rev. Gary Davis' Penitentiary Blues on the Blues Guitar of Rev. Gary Davis 2 DVD set. I have always loved this arrangement. I don't know if there being no recording of Rev. Gary Davis playing it excludes it from this topic but it surely is and interesting and fun piece to play in D position standard tuning.  I wonder if anyone on here has a recording of this song or heard the Rev. play it. ..

[frankie]

if you can call his tuning standard!

If Henry Thomas is a D-standard guy, so is Leadbelly...  tuning low is just capoing in reverse!

[banjochris]

if you can call his tuning standard!

If Henry Thomas is a D-standard guy, so is Leadbelly...  tuning low is just capoing in reverse!

That's an excellent point!

[Johnm]

Another one:  Memphis Minnie's "Soo Cow Soo".
All best,
Johnm

[banjochris]

Good point re Leadbelly, Chris.  Another thing about him is that he would sometimes play thumb lead out of D position in standard tuning, as on his version of "House of the Rising Sun", something Maybelle Carter never did once in the entire Carter Family recorded repertoire.  She's another player who eschewed D position altogether, at least on her recordings.

Did Maybelle ever record in anything other than C, G and F (not counting lap-style)?

Also, speaking of Leadbelly, an interesting thread might be African-American players who used thumb-lead on recordings.

[Johnm]

Maybelle had a couple of bluesy tunes out of E position, Chris.