Topic: Lonnie Johnson's Guitar Playing: Queries and Tips

[hylaphone]

hi friends, i been reading this board for a while, this is my first post. thanks to johnm for introducing me..

i've been working on a few lonnie johnson instrumentals, "To Do This You Got To Know How" and "I Done Told You", and i'm completely stumped with his tuning. i cant make heads or tails of the songs in DGDGBE, but i can approximate them in standard tuning, albeit as fluid as a cynder block.

has anyone tackled these? if you've any tips on the tunings and positions i'd be real grateful, and i'll look forward to spending many years trying to learn how to play them haha

thanks.

[waxwing]

I'm sorry I can't help you, but, in the unlikely event that you 'can't be satisfied' here, try posting at Ari Eisinger's Message Board. I know he's been working on a Lonnie Johnson lesson for Stefan G. In fact, why the heck don't we have Ari posting over here? Well, I'm sure he's been invited.
All for now.
John C.

[Slack]

Welcome to the forum hylaphone!

[frankie]

i cant make heads or tails of the songs in DGDGBE, but i can approximate them in standard tuning, albeit as fluid as a cynder block.

Hi there hylaphone - I'm sure that Ari would give you the definitive answer, but here's my take on it:  I just have my own ears to go by, but Lonnie Johnson's material in D seems to be played out of dropped-D (DADGBE).  I've never really heard anything in his tunes that convinced me that he dropped the 5th string down to G.  He might, in some cases, be tuned north or south of concert pitch, though.

[Rivers]

I agree with Frankie on this one but admit I haven't worked with the material very much at all. The one thing I did work on ages ago was Stefan G's dropped D Tribute To Lonnie which is derivitive only but very nice I thought. You have inspired me to investigate further.

[GhostRider]

Hey Hylaphone:

And I'm of the other opinion. I've hacked away at a few LJ songs, and tried Dropped D and Dropped DG. There are two things that lean me towards the latter. During G chord sections, I think I often hear the tonic in the bass, which is only possible by fretting the dropped D string at the 5th fret. This position pins the left hand to some degree.

In "Low Down St. Louis Women" (and other tunes) Lonnie did a little figure during the G section which starts with a 2nd to 4th fret slide on the G string, coincident with what sounds to me like a tonic bass note, which would require a quick grab of the bass string at the 5th fret with the thumb. This is very difficult for me, but could have been possible for a guitarist like LJ.

Dropped DG tuning requires that during the A sections the tonic in the base is either unavailable or requires fretting the 2nd fret of the dropped G string, again pinning the left hand to some degree. And thats what I seem to hear. LJ uses the A sections to either play single string stuff w/o bass notes or do those fabulous arpeggiated chord climbs.

But if I was you, I'd trust frankie and Rivers, not me.

Maybe the trick is to learn "Blue Ghost Blues" first. Its in Standard tuning, key of E.

Alex

[frankie]

I'd trust frankie and Rivers, not me.

Heh - and I'd trust JohnM & Ari!

I've not made a huge study of Lonnie Johnson, so I could easily be off the mark... 

[Richard]

Regarding "To Do This You Got To Know How" if of any help I have part (!) of a Stefan Grossman book on LJ and it says on the dots it's in D major and the tuning is DADGBE with a capo on fret 2 - any use?

[Bluesygirl]

Hi all,
Just came across this video on a cable program and love the tune and wish to learn it.  I love the T-bone-ish single note grooves that alternate with the strums.  What is the best way to learn this song?  It's not on the Woody Mann audio lesson book from Stefan Grossman.  Or would you just go from the You Tube video and try to learn that way? 

[Johnm]

Hi Bluesygirl,
I would encourage you to learn it from the video, both because I don't believe the performance has been transcribed, and because I don't there's any better way to learn a Lonnie Johnson tune than from Lonnie Johnson himself.  Best of luck with the project.
All best,
Johnm

[Stuart]

I believe that this video is from "The American Folk Blues Festival" DVD. Amazon doesn't list the contents, but I'm pretty sure that it's on Volume 1.

http://www.amazon.com/American-Folk-Blues-Festival-1962-1966/dp/B0000AYL2M

I agree with John--the best way to learn Lonnie is from Lonnie. I would get as much of his stuff as you can handle and immerse yourself.

[uncle bud]

Looks pretty doable from the video. It's got that third fret G chord done in an F shape with the wraparound thumb, beloved of Gary Davis, as the home chord. Go for it. Ask questions if you get stuck.

[Pan]

Looks pretty doable from the video. It's got that third fret G chord done in an F shape with the wraparound thumb, beloved of Gary Davis, as the home chord. Go for it. Ask questions if you get stuck.

The other chords seem to be an open position G7 chord preceding the C7 chord. The D7 chord is the C7 shape moved up two frets. Johnson also likes to approach the D7 chord from Eb7, again the same chord shape  one fret above. He also likes to throw in a minor iv chord in the turnaround. Something like this:

|| G | C7 | G | G7 |

| C7 | C7 | G | G |

| D7 | Eb7 D7 | G Cm | G , (Eb7) D7 ||

During the intro solo, however, the band plays bars 9 and 10 just as | D7 | C7 |...

Cheers

Pan

 

[frankie]

Watching that clip, it's very interesting to note how controlled Lonnie's picking is, and that when playing single-note runs, he picks down almost exclusively - no alternate picking here...

[Johnm]

Hi all,
It's a bit of a digression I'm posting, but you make a really interesting point re Lonnie Johnson's right hand technique with a pick and suave down-picking, Frank.  I've long thought that he was a hybrid picker all along rather than a finger-picker who switched to a flat pick later on.  And in his preference for down-picking vs. up-down alternation with the pick, he's in some excellent company:  Charlie Christian is supposed to have down-picked exclusively (amazing if true, at some of the tempos he chose), and a couple of additional ace down-pickers whom my brother once noted have very similar right hand technique in that regard--Bill Monroe (whew!) and Chuck Berry.
All best,
Johnm